i know there's hand wringing out there, maybe the folks on the right say under obama our taxes have gone up and we may more in taxes than we've ever paid and attempt to say, we're not-- >> this is long-term by the president and his allies to create an intellectual justification to raise taxes and in this case, they use the reagan years and often went back to times after world 2, where we were the only big kind of big, healthy industrial economy to say look, we grew then. and again, the point is that we're in a slow growth economy, high unemployment economy, a more competitive world thanks in part to our policies of the past, we need to compete and the highest corporate tax rate in the world, what america has is not the way to be competitive. >> to make the argument we've made is to raise taxes and revenues and approach the fiscal cliff and argument from small businesses and others, if you increase our rate, we're either going to have to layoff individuals, not going to hire anybody else right now, and so, therefore, this economy that's already stalled is not going to grow at a clip. >> y